#equine welfare

[local-hellhound-steals-spaghetti]

I don't know if this is something you'll be able to answer, but it's something I've been wondering for decades and I think you have the knowledge necessary for it.

So I used to ride horses for around 10 years, and when I first started to ride when I was around 8, when a horse was being super stuborn and didn't want to move. The riding instructor said it was okay to kick the horses as hard as I could (while I was sitting in the saddle) to get them moving, that they would bearly feel it cause they were so big, and their skin was thicker than ours.

And as a kid I trusted the adult instructor, but as I got older, and the more I interacted with horses and learnt how sensitive they could be to touch, I started to wonder if that was really okay, or if the only reason the horses seemed chill about it was cause they were used to it or something?

oh I just remembered a second thing I was wondering about, that same ranch also had a super old horse, I think he was in his 30s when I stopped going, was allowed to just wander around the ranch once he was retired, which I always sorta wondered if that was okay you know? he never seemed interested in leaving the ranch even tho there was nothing stopping him, and the part where cars could go was extremely small and they never went that fast anyways so I don't see why it'd be a bad thing, but I just couldn't shake the feeling it wasn't okay you know?

(I know these questions aren't about marine animals or even zoo animals, but I hope its okay for me to ask anyways, feel free to ignore if you want obvs)

Hi there! I don't mind horse questions - I used to work with them a lot and used to have my own horse!

I understand that feeling so well - there were so many times where I felt pressured to use excessive force with horses. Even with my own horse, because I was at the mercy of people who I thought knew best.

That's why I left the horse industry to work in the zoo and marine mammal field - so I could learn how to correctly, effectively and ethically apply positive reinforcement based training methods.

The last time I had a riding lesson was about a year ago. I wanted to give it a try again because I missed horses and it had been going fine. But the last time I was there, I left in tears because they put me on a horse that seriously needed to be retrained from the ground - and not be a lesson horse because he clearly hated it. I was not about to bully the horse into submission for the sake of getting my money's worth. I refused to "ride through" this horse's learned behaviour of stopping at arena corners and running my leg into the side of the arena. He wasn't listening to leg aids or rein aids. People had been riding him so inconsistently that he didn't even know what those signals meant anymore.

That's when people often will get out the whips and spurs to escalate those "aids". Because if all you're using is negative reinforcement/positive punishment and the aversive isn't working, you have to make that aversive even more uncomfortable/painful and "make them do it!". That's where things start to get really nasty, that's when conflict behaviours come up like rearing, bucking, bolting.

This animal was stressed, I was frustrated. He wasn't in a state to learn, he needed a break. He needed a chance to relearn those skills and be taught how to enjoy being ridden again. I refused to get into a fight with this horse. That isn't how I train and it won't be how I ride, either.

But horse riding is so heavily aversive based that escalation of aversives is just standard practise in riding schools.

When you were asked to kick harder, you were being asked to escalate the pressure for a horse that probably had become desensitised to softer leg aids. Lesson horses put up with so much incosistency, it makes sense that they get so "dull" to the aids.

There's also the issue of learned helplessness. When animals (and people) are put in a situation that they can't escape from, they give up trying to do so. They just sort of... tune everything out and become dull to any sort of learning process. It's sad because a lot of horses that people say are "bombproof" are just in a state of learned helplessness.

Horses absolutely do feel those kicks and they do not actually have "thick skin". They have thinner skin and even more nerve endings in their skin than we do!

The escalating use of force for "stubborn" horses is a symptom of an outdated industry that's still stuck in eltist tradition and would rather put a piece of twisted wire into a horse's mouth and spurs on rider's boots than re-teach skills from the ground or use positive reinforcement (treats are so taboo with horse people - they way they react, you'd think you'd brought a weapon into the yard and not a bag of carrots lol)

As for the wandering around? It's not ideal, sure. There's a certain amount of complacency in just expecting a free roaming animal not to leave the area. I guess as long as they're not standing in traffic/being a hazard/getting hurt it's okay but definitely not how I would be keeping my animals.

Anyway that was kind of long winded but I hope that helped!

[snowy-doe]

The way they edited out the gaping mouth in the goofiest way, but pain face is still the cover image representing the magic of Paris 2024.

This is honestly a perfect microcosm of the current state of equestrian sport (especially dressage).

(Gleerup et al., 2015)

Dalla Costa, E., Minero, M., Lebelt, D., Stucke, D., Canali, E., & Leach, M. C. (2014). Development of the Horse Grimace Scale (HGS) as a pain assessment tool in horses undergoing routine castration. PloS One, 9(3), e92281–e92281. https://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pone.0092281

Dyson, S., Berger, J., Ellis, A. D., & Mullard, J. (2018). Development of an ethogram for a pain scoring system in ridden horses and its application to determine the presence of musculoskeletal pain. Journal of Veterinary Behavior, 23, 47–57. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.jveb.2017.10.008

Dyson, S. (2022). The Ridden Horse Pain Ethogram. Equine Veterinary Education, 34(7), 372–380. https://doi.org/10.1111/eve.13468

Gleerup, K. B., Forkman, B., Lindegaard, C., & Andersen, P. H. (2015). An equine pain face. Veterinary Anaesthesia and Analgesia, 42(1), 103–114. https://doi.org/10.1111/vaa.12212

[thescienceofequus]

It’s been a long-held belief that horses’ intervertebral discs don’t degenerate except in rare cases. But recent study results have overturned that idea.

[pd-lyons]

Trust, by pd lyons

Trust I walk out with the horse, She does not resist. leads as if there’s not a diseased bone in her body.  does not notice children crying, rain stopping, sun brightening, but rather a yellow butterfly – moves her head to keep it in sight until for some reason she will never know,  can no longer do so. yellow years ago worked for several intense years with a horse rescue rehab group in…

[girderednerve]

so i've been watching the olympics!

i ideologically reject the olympics & they should not be held. however, it is fun to watch sports on television, especially if you, like me, are a fan of weird sports that aren't televised often (equestrian sports!).

there are a lot of problems with equestrian sports, mostly that they're capital-intensive, which is to say that they're inaccessible & elitist. the big controversy this olympics relates to animal welfare, though. there have been scandals in the past, but this year, right before the olympic games, charlotte dujardin, a very famous & celebrated dressage rider, withdrew from competition pending an investigation for animal welfare by the FEI & british dressage federation after the release of a video that is at least two years old (age contested) of her repeatedly striking at the legs of a client's horse with a long whip during a training session. i will note that she has previously had to withdraw from an international competition after blood was found on her horse (they check bits & spurs every round). charlotte dujardin is famous & celebrated because she has had incredibly good, record-breaking results in international competition, despite her relatively young age (gold medalist in her 20s, when people remain competitive in this sport into their 60s). she also competed in international dressage wearing a riding helmet, which was not at all conventional in the 2010s, although it is now in part because of her influence. when she won her gold medals at the 2012 olympics, she was riding at home & was met with a massive swelling of national pride by british viewers.

international dressage competition was dominated by german riders (isabell werth is like, the queen mother of dressage basically), and there had just been a huge controversy about animal welfare centering on the practice of rollkur, a training method in which the horse's head is pulled in very close to their chest, which is a very unnatural way for a horse to move & involves a lot of force exerted on the bit(s) in the horse's mouth. i strongly agree that rollkur is bad and should not be done, but the public discussion about it immediately became extremely messy, because a) some fans were looking for a reason to discount german records & decry german horsemanship and b) we couldn't agree what rollkur actually is! the FEI said that you can't do rollkur, but that it's fine to use a "deep & round" training frame, which is, um, different, because it's not mean? which is nonsense, or at least very difficult to enforce by eye, but sort of understandable; i myself have spent plenty of time on a horse (my beloved friend, strudel the pony) who habitually ducks behind the bit & carries his head low & behind the vertical. while it's straightforward to identify & sanction extreme cases (e.g., patrik kittel's blue-tongued horse), it can be much harder to agree on other instances, keeping in mind that you only see a very small piece of a rider's general practice in competition. judges are supposed to penalize movements in which the horse's head is behind the vertical, but in practice they spent years penalizing carriage in front of the vertical more sharply & consistently (this has begun to shift in the last couple years, but the rollkur stuff was happening in like, 2010). this sport is an old, strange, slow-moving patchwork of styles, full of people who are deeply particular, territorial, & aesthetically conservative. there's also a huge variation in how horses themselves behave; they have character, personality, & preferences. none of which lessens the burden of responsibility on riders & people who work with horses to make sure that they are cared for well, but does make adjudicating an individual case complicated. of course, it's also intensely emotionally charged, because we are, & ought to be, outraged by animal abuse.

anyway the thing i'm trying to get at is that we don't have a cultural consensus on what animal welfare in equestrian sports ought to look like. i realize that sounds like rank apologia, which i am not trying to do; i have not watched the video of charlotte dujardin in the training session, because i don't have the stomach for it & am not interested in trying to argue about this one case. the bigger & more interesting issue to me is that i think there's a general cultural shift, in the sport & beyond it, around what we think is appropriate to ask from a horse. like i said, people have long careers in this sport, & it's culturally conservative on its own; i rode a couple times with a celebrated british rider whose father was responsible for determining which horses to care for & which to put down during world war ii (!!!), which obviously accompanied an extremely different attitude towards horses & the labor we expect from them than anything you might find in a modern barn. many of these determinations about equine welfare are being conducted on the public stage, by people who have never spent significant time around horses; the video of dujardin hitting a horse aired on good morning britain. there's also a vibrant, very opinionated amateur community, who have spent time with horses but aren't professionals. i do think there's a meaningful difference between having a horse who is your buddy & spending all day working with horses, having sort of done both; i don't think it's particularly edgy to say that you treat an activity differently when it's your job than when it's a thing you're doing for fun & stress relief.

when i was taught to ride, i was told (& of course believed!) that it's fine & appropriate to punch a horse with my stupid seven-year-old fists if they knocked me around with their big horse faces, which made me feel weird when kim raisner was banned from the german pentathlon team for same, but then she obviously was not seven. i'm not quite sure what i think about it; the argument in favor of smacking a horse is that they're big & dangerous if they don't have manners, & in my experience they didn't really care. i feel some shame & conflict about this now that i am years away from working with horses, but i also recall trying to make sure that the horses i was around knew me & weren't afraid of me. we had solid working relationships from my perspective, but of course i can't go back & ask the horses. increasingly, i think excellent animal welfare is probably just not compatible with large-scale competitive sport, or, perhaps, with a capitalist environment. hot take, i guess!

one thing i think about a lot is that while there obviously is money in dressage, there's not nearly as much money in it as there is in horse racing, which is, from my perspective, a hugely destructive & cruel industry for horses & for people. horses die racing. people die caring for them, almost all of them undocumented barn workers. dressage defines itself in opposition to this approach—many amateurs pride themselves upon the differences—but i'm not convinced that the kinder ideas we have now of how to coexist with animals scale with revenue-generating industry, even outside of racing.

anyway, it makes people uncomfortable, and it makes me uncomfortable too. i think we'll see some comparatively rapid change in the next five years or so. the future of equestrian sports in the olympics is in question, as the olympics desperately try to stay relevant & interesting to younger generations (do kids like, uh, breakdancing? skateboarding? metal bands???). there's also an image crisis more broadly. the olympic ideal has shifted over the years, but a lot of the people involved in planning the games have self-aggrandizing ideas about what they're doing & the utopian potential of sports. equestrian sports have a martial history, which commentary generally elides, but is revealing in its way about the historical purpose of the olympiad. if the public conversation is focused on how this sport, which is expensive to put on & pulls low viewership numbers, is a harm to horses (&, in the popular mind, is not so much a sport as an exercise in expensive sitting, cf. the comedy around the romney-owned dressage horse), then the whole facade is crumbling. i guess it's better for the IOC for us all to worry about charlotte dujardin's heavy whip hand than it is for us to ask why israel is competing, or how well the unhoused people of paris are faring during these expensive spectacles, but surely they'd rather we set aside those conversations to talk about how inspiring the whole games are.

[poniesatemypencils]

Say no to horse abuse.

There's far too much normalisation of unethical practices in the equestrian community, especially in the Olympics. Already I saw a photo of a horse with their head pulled in towards their chest, gaping mouth with frothy saliva dripping down from their mouth... It's sickening and heartbreaking to see.

[chicken-blitz13]

Its crazy how people forget basic biology of horses. I saw a video on instagram of ICELANDIC HORSES chilling in the snow and non horse people in the comments saying “GIVE THEM BLANKETS! THEY’RE COLD”  Bestie those horses are clearly fine, the snow is on top of their fur which means the heat is trapped within their body 👏STOP👏 

[ametamorphosisaddiction]

Part One; The Heart and Hardship of Animal Rescue: A Journey of Compassion and Survival

I often find people amazed by my extensive experience with animal rescue and street vet work, particularly when I share some of the most challenging and occasionally amusing stories. My journey into animal rescue began when I was just a toddler, following in my mother’s footsteps. She had been rescuing animals since she was a young adult, passing her compassion for animals onto me. Our…

[buckleyanddiaz]

one underrated part about the Charlie (shooting) arc was Eddie encouraging Chris and Charlie to talk on the video call, helping Chris sort out the stuff he wants to share, and being generally a kind adult to Charlie from the start. no wonder it was seeing Charlie flourish at the equine therapy ranch that got Eddie's hopes back again. he had been invested in the kid's welfare long before he went to the call that ended with him being shot.

[local-hellhound-steals-spaghetti]

Btw when you look at photos of horses in equestrian sports, keep the Equine Pain Scale in mind. There's a lot to be said about horses being extremely good at masking pain and discomfort as a prey animal. If they screamed when they were in pain, I wonder if some methods and certain types of tack would have ever been allowed at all...

Source

[spiraltastic]

Yeah but cows form complex social relationships

[camillasgirl]

King Charles III and Queen Camilla will undertake a State Visit to Kenya

The visit will take place from Tuesday 31st October to Friday 3rd November 2023, and will celebrate the warm relationship between the two countries and the strong and dynamic partnership they continue to forge.

The visit is at the invitation of President Ruto and comes as Kenya prepares to celebrate 60 years of independence. His Majesty’s first visit to a Commonwealth nation as King is therefore to the country in which Queen Elizabeth II’s reign began, having acceded to the throne in Kenya in February 1952.

The King and Queen will visit Nairobi City County, Mombasa County and surrounding areas. Their Majesties’ programme will reflect the ways in which Kenya and the United Kingdom are working together, notably to boost mutual prosperity, tackle climate change, promote youth opportunity and employment, advance sustainable development and create a more stable and secure region.

During the visit, Their Majesties will meet President Ruto and the First Lady as well as and other members of the Kenyan Government, UN staff, CEOs, faith leaders, young people, future leaders and Kenyan Marines training with UK Royal Marines. The King will also attend an event to celebrate the life and work of the Nobel Laureate the late Professor Wangari Maathai, together with Wangari’s daughter, Wanjira Mathai.

The King and Queen’s programme will celebrate the close links between the British and Kenyan people in areas such as the creative arts, technology, enterprise, education and innovation. The visit will also acknowledge the more painful aspects of the UK and Kenya’s shared history, including the Emergency (1952-1960). His Majesty will take time during the visit to deepen his understanding of the wrongs suffered in this period by the people of Kenya. Together, Their Majesties will tour a new museum dedicated to Kenya’s history and will lay a wreath at the Tomb of the Unknown Warrior at Uhuru Gardens, as well as visiting the site of the declaration of Kenya’s independence in 1963.

The King and Queen’s programme also will include:

Their Majesties will be greeted in Nairobi with a ceremonial welcome at State House and will each attend bilateral meetings – The King with The President and The Queen with the First Lady, before The President hosts a State Banquet at State House.

His Majesty will visit the United Nations Office at Nairobi, to learn more about the work of UN Habitat and the UN Environment Programme. UNON is the only UN Headquarters in the Commonwealth.

His Majesty will attend a technology showcase, meeting Kenyan entrepreneurs who are driving forward innovation in the country’s tech sector. Kenya has the third largest start up eco-system in Africa.

His Majesty will host a reception focussed on Kenya’s young people and future leaders across development, trade, media, the creative arts and environmental conservation.

Their Majesties will visit a Commonwealth War Graves Commission cemetery, joining British and Kenyan military personnel in an act of Remembrance, before hearing about the Commission’s recent work to ensure all those who supported Britain’s efforts in both World Wars are commemorated.

The King and Queen will visit Nairobi National Park to witness the vital conservation work being undertaken by the Kenya Wildlife Service, which is integral to Kenya’s thriving tourism industry.

Her Majesty, Patron of the equine welfare charity Brooke, will hear how the charity is working with the Kenya Society for the Protection and Care of Animals to rescue donkeys at risk and promote their welfare.

The King, as Captain General of the Royal Marines, and The Queen, will visit Mtongwe Naval Base in Mombasa. There, Their Majesties will witness Kenyan Marines, trained by the Royal Marines, demonstrating a covert beach landing, showing defence collaboration in action.

The Queen will meet survivors of sexual and gender-based violence, learning how they are supported and sharing her own insights from working in this area.

The King will meet faith leaders from Mombasa’s diverse community, hearing how they are working together to promote harmony amongst the city’s population.

[horsesarecreatures]

"The FEI has apparently rowed back on its own proposal to sanction national equestrian federations with a “prevalence” of doping. If the measure had gone forward it would most likely have penalised the sport’s wealthiest benefactors; Middle Eastern endurance racing still returns more positives than any other region or any other FEI discipline.

New sanctions were suggested last year following a significant spike in positives in Saudi Arabia.  But despite enquiries by HorseSport.com over the past seven weeks, the FEI has declined to confirm if new sanctions are in the draft EADCMP (anti-doping) rules for 2025, slated for debate at the FEI Sport Forum on April 29-30.

The FEI already stands accused of succumbing to “sportswashing” through allocating this week’s World Cup jumping and dressage finals to Saudi Arabia. Three leading equestrian news organisations, The Horse Magazine, Reiten St Georg and WorldofShowjumping.com  announced a boycott, largely citing Saudi Arabia’s attitude to human rights.

The FEI is, however, is challenged in finding hosts for their major events which is a topic of discussion at their Sports Forum next week. As of now, the FEI has not yet received an application to host next year’s European Jumping, Eventing, or Senior Para Championships. The announcement about Saudi Arabia hosting these Finals was announced at the end of 2019 (four and half years ahead of the event) and it’s not clear whether any bidding took place. Typically, the FEI offers the chance to bid on hosting the World Cup Finals three years in advance.

Simultaneously, HorseSport.com has pressed the FEI on the contradiction of allocating “big-ticket” championships to countries with known equine doping and cheating problems at a time when the FEI is focussed on public concern about sport horse welfare and the Social Licence to Operate (SLO).

Since 2019, FEI endurance racing has been heavily promoted at Al Ula in Saudi Arabia. It has staged the world’s richest annual race ever since the Al Wathba venue in UAE pulled the Presidents Cup from the FEI calendar in reaction to the stricter FEI endurance rules effective from 2020.

There have always been multiple doping positives from Al Ula, involving cocktails of up to seven different drugs, highlighting the ease with which routinely doped horses progress to top level endurance sport. In 2020, the FEI disciplined three senior officials for “failing in their duty” after a large number of field-of-play violations at Al Ula were not not acted upon.

Last November Al Ula was allocated the 2026 FEI World Endurance Championships, despite having recently returned the greatest number of positives (14 Saudi owned and trained horses out of the 33 sampled) at any single show or event in equestrian anti-doping history. One rider-trainer received a record seven-and-a-half-year ban. Sampling returns from the big 2024 Al Ula fixture are notably better, but could not have been predicted last November.

Not surprisingly, the FEI seems reluctant to answer the question actually asked regarding Saudi Arabia by any media organisation."

[pokemonshelterstories]

My main partner (Mudsdale, M10) has been trying to kidnap the other Pokémon he sees around the neighborhood, and I’ve had to return half of them because they’re already owned and just being adopted by my giant mud horse.

I think he’s trying to start his own herd/family, but he was raised by himself, and I’ve only had other Pokémon for about two or three years, so I think it’s just instinct kicking in…

Got any Mudbray or other equine Pokémon that he could buddy up with? I’ve got space enough…

i'm trying to interpret this correctly, but...is your mudsdale just. allowed to wander around other people's properties? i'm surprised your neighbors haven't called the rangers on you yet. it's your responsibility to keep your pokemon contained on your property. even if your neighbors are doing the same, it's highly irresponsible to just let your pokemon wander, especially one as large and powerful as a mudsdale.

it's also concerning that your mudsdale has been alone most of its life. these are herding animals that need company. i'm glad you have other pokemon now, but that is a serious welfare concern.

we do currently have a mudbray up for adoption, but until you address the containment of your mudsdale, we cannot adopt out to you.

[isthehorsevideocute]

So NOW is the time people are trying to rally behind banning equestrian sports from the Olympics...... I mean am I even surprised? Media literacy is so dead its leaking into people's real life critical thinking.

Abuse being publicized and addressed by the FEI is good. Its great. It's the necessary ugliness that shows us that things are going in the right direction for welfare. The policy of enforcing social license to operate is in its infancy and its already showing results.

Sorry but if you seeing the FEI as being open about abuse cases (naturally making us see it more because its in the open and not stuck behind closed doors) and you have the brain dead take of "Look bad thing! Ban now!" sorry but you lack any amount of nuance and clearly don't care about context. You are on the same level of dumb as the people fighting tooth and nail to defend these abusive assholes. Whether you are trying to excuse abuse or use it to rally against the presence of equine sports in the Olympics you are doing equal harm to the industry as a whole.

If we are going to be able to change the culture that has normalized abuse in many places the best thing we can do is start at the top. A certain someone apparently thinks the only reason one would care about equestrian sports in the Olympics is because "you want to think you have a shot at making it". That's far from the truth. The presence of equestrian sports for better or worse has a massive influence on the industry. The rules for olympic level equestrian sports help define all levels below it. The Olympics brings a lot of prospective riders in and generally educates the public about the industry. This makes it even more important to take welfare into account as the Olympics can make or break public opinion and attract or repel people from the horse industry as a whole.